Episode #395
The daughter of Jamaican immigrants, Jackie Fabulous grew up in The Bronx but went to law school in Southern California before deciding in her mid-30s to pursue a career in stand-up comedy. After some initial TV credits on Arsenio and Last Comic Standing, her comedy path began to become truly fabulous after she competed on America’s Got Talent in 2019. She moved back to The Bronx just before the pandemic, and since then has performed twice on The Tonight Show, booked gigs on Showtime’s Flatbush Misdemeanors and HBO’s That Damn Michael Che, and recorded her first hour-long stand-up special, Menoplause, released in July 2022 via Comedy Dynamics. Fabulous joined me over Zoom to talk about her life and career.
Here’s the trailer for her new special, out now!
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Last things first: Congratulations on your new special! How does it feel?
It feels good! To have me out there in the world doing more than five or eight minutes of stand-up. That’s the point of it.
But that’s, for would-be comedians, that’s where it starts. You have to get that first five or eight minutes before you can get an hour.
Oh, yes, I wasn’t allowed to do more than five minutes for quite some time in the beginning. Like literally they’re like, no this is where you are. This is your sweet spot. And then once I started to, I guess, dominate the five minutes, then they’re like OK, now you can do 10. OK, now you can host. OK, now you can feature. It’s a process that nobody wants to acknowledge anymore. It’s a long-ass process.
But there can be fun amid the struggle of the process. Like I’m speaking to you, right now, I’m in New York City. You’re in Las Vegas. But I know that a few years ago you were in Las Vegas tooling around Sin City with Will Smith.
Oh, yeah! Yes.
Just so people know you recorded your special after you met Will Smith, but before the Oscars. But you mention both Will and Chris Rock in the special, and I’d like to know — last things first — as a legal professional, which you are: What advice would you give Will and Chris? Legally! I mean, I know you give them other types of advice within the jokes of your hour.
I forgot! Every now and then I’m like, oh shit. I forgot I talked about them so much
Sexual advice! You gave them sexual advice.
I really don’t know what I said, I was so nervous. Legal advice? I don’t have any! Because they decided to handle it or not handle it or just move on with their lives. What could Will do? Will doesn’t have any legal recourse. There’s always slander and libel. But Chris didn’t make any kind of comments or statements about Jada that would have to be proven to be true or untrue. That’s not there. And of course there’s assault. Unwanted touching a person’s body, that’s always a crime. It could be a misdemeanor. It could be a felony, but clearly Chris is like, I got a tour to plan. I don’t have time to go to court.
So Jackie, you’re the daughter of immigrants from Jamaica, right?
The face of Jamaican immigrants. Yes, sir.
Your initial foray was into the law. You went to law school. Was that because you were a child of immigrants? That was deemed more living the American dream than being a stand-up comedian?
Oh, that’s way deeper than I deserve. (we both laugh) Has nothing to do with that. It was from watching lawyers on TV. There was a soap opera on years ago called Ryan’s Hope. And there was a woman lawyer on there named Jillian, and I’m traditional, family ignored me, Latch Key kid. Go watch TV. That’s your best friend. You don’t have siblings. Leave us alone. So I watched a lot of TV, and soap operas had a lot of lawyers on it and I thought it was a sexy job. But then as I got older, I’m like oh, they feel like they have power. But really what I did, I was a paralegal in New York for a big law firm. You know, big moneymakers, and honestly my ego got tired of being their assistant, their number two, their lackey. I wanted to be boss. I didn’t want to be the assistant. I wanted to be an attorney. The attorneys walked around the law firm, the paralegals and whatever were the ones who worked for them. I didn’t want to be a para, I wanted to be the man. But I was a horrible student. Average grades, never really above a B or a C. So I couldn’t get a good score on the LSAT. And I couldn’t get what I had to get to get into the good schools in New York. So I got into some school in California and went there because they said we’ll let you in. You have a negative 1.4 GPA but we will let you in. And that is a reason why I was in California for so long. I went there to go to law school. And then life happened after that. So, nothing deep.
So what were you doing with the law when you decided to show up at comedy clubs in LA?
I’ve managed to escape the responsibility of taking the Bar after getting a law degree, for no reason other than fear. Didn’t take the Bar, but because I had a law degree, I am considered a lawyer. You’re an attorney when you pass the Bar. You can help people legally. You’re licensed. When you have a JD, Juris Doctorate, you are a lawyer and I can practice federal law. But I can’t help you in your hometown if you get arrested or whatever.
What were you doing when you decided to drop that for comedy?
Good corporate job. I had good corporate jobs. So I didn’t have to chuck I was — oh, OK, I did have to chuck. You know how you block out traumatic events? I worked at Caltech in Pasadena. And I was doing stand-up afterward at night, whatever commercial auditioning whatever and they fired me. Because I got fired in 2010, from Caltech, the California Institute of Technology, I took my unemployment from that point on. Thank you, Obama. Five years of the top-limit unemployment, supplemented my comedy career with unemployment, and I was out on a whim after work. There was no reason, no goal, no entertainment goals. I don’t want to be an actor. None of that crap. I was just bored. And I was the funny girl all through life. And my girlfriend told me, take this comedy class. Judy Carter. Everybody knows about her in the comedy community.
Well, I don’t know if the kids know about Judy Carter.
There’s nobody really under 30 taking her course and those are the ones who need to take it! Judy Carter, I took her class after work. The first show, Sept. 16, 15-16 years ago at the Hollywood Improv, and that’s when I decided OK, I’m good at this. I suck at everything else. Every job I’ve had, bullshit. I don’t know how I even got hired. But stand-up, I excelled at early. Excel enough to not quit. I wasn’t Chappelle, but I didn’t stink. So I’m OK. I don’t suck. I’m not bombing regularly. I’m gonna keep up with this. And I liked it. Fun. Honestly, the reason why I stuck with it cuz it was fun. Every job I had was not fun. Jobs and not fun. In case people don’t know that.
How much do you think the fact that you waited until your 30s to start helped you because you had all of that life experience to draw upon?
I guess for lack of not sounding like a cliche, it’s because I was a grown-ass woman when I started. When I started, my immediate family, the ones who you worry about — the mother or father, aunt, uncle sister — were not in LA. They were in New York. I was in Cali, juggling a divorce and then getting back to dating and struggling, hating my day job and working at night so I knew how to handle what life throws at you. Where a lot of comics that I know have never ever ever, ever ever had a regular job. So when adversity hits, it hits them hard. Like being broke not having gas money. When I was in LA, when gas prices would go really high in LA, I just wouldn’t go anywhere. I would stay in my apartment for two weeks. You learn how to adapt. I bought groceries I filled my house up. I have a car but guess what, can’t afford to drive it. So I’m gonna leave it there. And I learned, I have real-life coping abilities that a lot of comics don’t. The ones who went from their parents house to stand-up. There’s something to be admired by that also, it’s actually quite sexy to be able to be like, I’m not gonna do anything y’all do. I want to go from my neighborhood to the stage and I just had life in between because I didn’t know what I wanted to be. I thought I wanted to be an attorney, clearly, and when I tried it, I’m like, this sucks.
You mention the importance of having coping skills. How important was that, then, when you realized over the course of your first decade in comedy your first decade in comedy that it was gonna take a while to get a break and to get seen? You had things over the years like you did Arsenio, you were in Last Comic Standing. But then it wasn’t until a few years after that, that America’s Got Talent really gave you that audience that you needed.
Last Comic Standing — I got eliminated like during the commercial break. Like that’s how fast, that’s how long I was on that show. When I tell you that I was dying. I was one of those that thought if I get on Last Comic, I will be forever changed. It’s like people who do commercials. When I booked my first big national (ad), it was Progressive with Flo and stuff. I’m like, I’m gonna buy a castle. This is it! I’m gonna buy the school across the street. Nothing close to that. So I thought I was one of the comics who thought the holy grail was Last Comic Standing and doing late-night and whatever and none of that, nothing happened. So I still currently do a lot of mentors who gave me advice, who would take me out for dinners and lunches, and invite me to their houses because I would reach out to them like look, I don’t know why I’m not progressing. I don’t know what’s going on. I remember when I hit my seven-year mark, David Arnold, who is one of my really good friends and mentors. He would take me for breakfast like once a month because he knew I needed to vent somewhere. And I wanted to vent with somebody who wasn’t a woman. David for some reason was my tough love mentor and he was where I wanted to be. So he brought me to the restaurant, on Ventura Boulevard in the Valley, Marmalades. And he takes me there just so I could complain. And he was like Jackie, at the seven-year mark, I find a lot of comics get really really frustrated because they’re like, why am I not, you know, moving from 10 minutes to featuring? And I was going through that when I realized, that’s everybody. It’s going to be a plateau you’re gonna reach. Everyone’s case is different. And you have to know that if you’re enjoying it, and you’re making some money at all doing it, that you shouldn’t quit. If you’re constantly told by your friends, your peers, fans and people and strangers, that you’re good. That all keeps you doing it. You know if I didn’t have any kind of good words. from anyone. I’d be like, well, maybe this ain’t it. But because I am literally bombarded with, Thank you, God. That’s people, friends and strangers, not family saying that, but strangers and friends are the ones who have been like, You really gave me a good time. I didn’t know who you were. I didn’t want to come out. I have no idea who you are. I didn’t see shit you’ve done. I didn’t see Last Comic, didn’t see AGT. A lot of those go out there. All they have is proof that I belong where I am in that club on that stage is when they come see me. And like a lot of first timers when they’re like oh OK. I like you. I’ve never heard of you. But you know what? Keep it up! Don’t quit. So a lot of people have told me not to stop, because they saw something in me that I didn’t see in myself. And in the beginning, all I was doing was hanging around a bunch of male comics, lovingly and unknowingly and wanting to, only girl so I’m gonna join the male company and the free drinks. I’m hanging out after work. I’m not thinking this is a career.
You know, most comics dream about not having a day job but in your special Menoplause, you’re pretty open about missing the day job. You talk about missing that nine to five.
Yeah, I don’t miss the work. I miss, it’s lonely.
Is it because stand-up comedy doesn’t have like a clubhouse or break room — well, there’s the green room, but
The break room was the green room, but honestly, doing this job, I’m in a hotel now in Vegas alone. Usually I’m here with my fiance, but ticket prices are now $8,000 to go to Baltimore. So that’s not going to stop until the gas prices go down. So this job is lonely. So having a nine to five I had friends, girlfriends. You know, you work all day with somebody next to you to giggle with and laugh with. When you’re writing your jokes or working on your set or whatever, you’re alone more than you’re around people. Obviously, stand-up clubs, I’m in them almost every night, but honestly that’s because I have nothing else. That’s my only job. You know, I’m writing during the day, working on a lot of good projects and I hope to God you guys get to hear about but until then, it’s a solo job.
Companionship is important in life. Butch Bradley. He lives in Vegas and I saw him last time and he made a comment that made me think. He’s like, no one wants you to think in stand-up that you can have a partner and pets and a life and travel. They kind of want you to have this feeling of you have to be broke and lonely and horny and confused. That’s the job. And the older you get, the more you’re like that doesn’t have to be in the job. You can have a suburban life and go do stand-up. That’s more possible for men than it is for the wives and the moms. But it is possible to you know, kind of do it all and enjoy it all at the same time, but when I don’t enjoy it is when I’m going to stop. Like that’s my thing for life. I’ve had a lot of jobs and when I started hating it I’m gonna move on to something else. In entertainment but not so much stand-up and traveling alone around the world all the time.
You could become a manager.
No. Like TV. Like Page Hurwitz. Like leave stand-up and produce TV, and deny your stand-up background.
But is your mom like my mom? You say you want a job in TV and so my mom would go well Wendy Williams just left her job, so there’s an opening on TV. Does your mom go: That should be you! You should get them to give you Wendy Williams’ job now?
My aunty always asked me, back in the day like when I first started, she’d be like it was Sherri Shepherd, so and so on and so on so and so and so. And as soon as I became friends with Sherri Shepherd, and I told my family they were like, well now everything you need is there! I’m like she’s my girlfriend. That’s it. There’s nothing else. They think if you know someone famous, all you got to do is be like, well, where’s my office? That’s not how it works.
Right, you need a sidekick Sherri!? Sherri?
Now that she’s so busy with her own show I might work more.
You can get those gigs she can’t do now.
I belong to a circle of female black plus-sized funny comics. Kym Whitley, Sherri Shepherd Retta, Loni Love, Michelle Buteau. It’s like a little posse. And, I’ve always been told when these women get crazy busy, that’s when they’ll be like, what’s Jackie doing? So, that’s where I am now where a lot of my my co-workers, the Nicole Byers who’s on four shows right now. The busier they are. The more I’m like, Hey, you can use me now.
Where does Mo’Nique fit in that posse?
I don’t know Mo’Nique, but she gave me my first break at an Improv. I will say that. Years ago my first stand-up at an Improv comedy club, Brea. I went to watch her. I think I had a date that stood me up. Long story short, and he probably will see this and you should know. But I went to see her and I sat where she could see me, because I wanted her to see me. And after the show I stood online with the other fans to go say hi, and when I saw here, I said, ‘Hey Mo’Nique. I really love you. You were funny. I’m a huge fan. And I’m a comic.’ She immediately said right after that, ‘Do you want to do time?’ And I was like, the place is packed, 300-plus, and I’m like sure! So the next show, after the show cleared out, she had me do like 8-9 minutes, which is a long guest set for someone she didn’t know, and then she’s like you want to come back tomorrow? And I came back tomorrow and did it again. That’s my only dealing with Monique is how she was wonderful to me when I was green as hell.
How important then was it for you to watch her go through the turmoil she did with Netflix and with speaking out for her rights?
I think she’s doing what she needs to do for her and her career, because she’s been doing this since longer than I even care. The only thing I will say is I would, if it was me I would fight less of my battles on social media. But I say that not knowing how she feels. Like I have been mad enough about whatever in life and be like I’m gonna Tweet this and fix it. Or I’m gonna Facebook it and fix it. So when you’re heated and in the middle of it, you just want how you feel to get out there. So she probably is like I maybe tomorrow I might regret it, but today I’m gonna let the whole world know that so-and-so, and so-and-so, and so-and-so, and so-and-so, and so-and-so, and so-and-so did this to me. So I wouldn’t do it online. but I’m not her. I don’t know how she feels when you are in the moment and angry. We all handle our business differently.
And in 2022 there’s a lot more people who are angry and justifiably so.
So many more people who are pissed off. And if we all fight it out on Instagram, it’s not gonna be fun on IG anymore. I want to see kittens and the new lip gloss. Why is everybody fighting?
At least if you’re going to fight, fight over dropping beats, like Verzuz.
Exactly. Entertain me. you’re gonna fight, pop and lock while you do it. This is really making my experience on IG a downer.
Let’s turn that downer upside around. America’s Got Talent is such a weird wild show to watch because when it started out it felt very much like American Idol in which they gleefully roasted people for not having talent as much as they did the people who have talent, but by the time you did AGT, it really has become more of this inspirational, uplifting summer showcase where it’s like no, America really does have talent. The show celebrates people now. They have so many standing ovations. Did you know what was going to be in store for you when you decided to do it?
When I tell you that I did not know, I had never watched the show. At that point in time, I’m like, actually, the year before I did it, I did audition for the producers. And I did it in Pasadena. I did it like in the middle of the afternoon as a throwaway because I didn’t care. I didn’t want to do it. I talked bad about reality back then like everybody else. I’m like, this is a craft. I will not do a reality series. To be honest, I didn’t get it and they could tell, ah, she don’t care about this. Then the next year. I literally looked out for somebody that I knew who was a producer there. And I’m like hey, do I have to go through the whole rigmarole? I still felt kind of experienced by then. And I wanted to try and mooch my way on it. I don’t want to have to be on line. I wanted to be treated like a star. So she’s like, I don’t know all that star business. But send me your tape. And I’ll send to those who make the decisions. She got my tape, sent it in, called me and said they want you to come do it. I’m thinking like audition. And they were like, no, no, just come do the show. And I’m like, I don’t gotta do it? She’s like no, because they can tell from what I sent them. I know what I’m doing. Not to be arrogant. And I got there and they just gave me you know, the whole spiel, the training, the pep talk, the dry run, the run through and the first time the whole world saw it was my first time on the show. And people backstage were like you know, Simon hates stand-up. He hates comedy. And I’m like, how’s this gonna help me? This is a pep talk? Do y’all know what a pep talk is? And I was hanging out back and literally, there were so many hours in the back waiting. And I’m looking around and what I’m competing with, gigantic poodles, these dogs were as big as horses. There was a man who shot himself out of a cannon on purpose. I was kind of backstage like, What could possibly go wrong? There are acrobats and and gymnasts back here and I’m gonna tell a few jokes, and go home. So that’s why I’m like, all I’m gonna do is get exposure. I know they’re gonna laugh. Because I gave them jokes that I know always, always, always works. So I was nervous because it was a big show, but I wasn’t worried about doing well, because I gave them what I know always worked. And it’s like if they didn’t laugh, they will at least like me. Like if I die tomorrow, my tombstone should say likable. Most of my career is that and you know, I’m OK with it. Because likeable will get me in the door to show OK, now she has talent. So when I got there, and everyone had their reaction, I felt comfortable in front of Howie because like, you know that whole comic fellowship. Because he’s a comic.
Howie gets it.
He’ll at least be like alright, we see you do this for real. And they had a black woman so that that also made me feel like OK, Gabby Union. She might be like, Okay, girl! I won’t dismiss you immediately. And Dancing with the Stars Julianne Hough, I love the show, so I was fangirling over her. And then Simon I was, I’m not gonna lie. Part of me is like if he talks to me, either before or after, I’m going to flirt with him. Because that was my tactic. I’m like, look, I think I’m cute. I know he ain’t married. I’m gonna try and flirt. So when he kind of flirted with me by saying, Can I come kiss you? I was like, OK. I thought it was going to be on the mouth. I was ready. When I went through that little stretch, I was stretching because we landed on national TV, international TV. And he only gave me that sweet European double one. I’m like, OK I was ready for the mouth. Because I’m like, I’m trying to win. I don’t know what y’all talking about, who do I gotta blow to move ahead to the final? You know, so I was kind of impatient. Let’s move this along. Let’s go what do I need to hear? And so I didn’t know what, I had no idea what I was getting into. But everyone there is so nice. And even more so than nice and professional, it’s clockwork. The place is run like they know what they’re doing. No one’s left hanging. Everyone got a walkie talkie thing in the air. It’s very smoothly run over there. I had no idea but that is the show that told the world who I was. And when I started touring and when the show ended shortly afterwards, that’s when COVID was like, Oh, you’re gonna stay home for two years.
So when did moving back to New York enter the equation? Was it because of the show or was it because of COVID?
It was boredom. I was bored in LA. I was auditioning like crazy for a really big thing. Pilots, TV shows. I’m not booking anything. The stand-up gigs that I wanted that were my high profile I wasn’t able to get. I wanted to be passed at the Comedy Store. I was just back and bored. So I moved in October 2019. Pre all this and back into my childhood home in The Bronx with the intent of, I’ll go home for a little while. I was touring like crazy, and I was making touring money. I’m like I want to get a place. And after a few months of being home was when I started to get really sick, and I was touring sick, and I thought it was the flu. Went to the doctor. He’s like this is not the flu. We don’t know what this is. But it was right when everyone was like, getting sick and not knowing why. And then after that I was home for a while. My first time out was when Russell Peters offered me to go with him to the Miami Improv during the height of the pandemic. And that got me back out there. Thanks to him. I did a lot of outdoor shows in New York, rooftop, outdoor, I was out. I wasn’t out like crazy, but I was out even though I live with old people. I couldn’t sit at home. I was going crazy.
You have also been able to book quite a few things. I mean, you’ve done The Tonight Show twice?
Yes! Since I moved back to New York, so many of the things that I had on my vision board that I was not getting done in LA, happened. I moved back to New York. I booked four TV shows back to back. I did Tonight Show twice. I did my special and my album. But what I really wanted to start happening more was acting, and when I moved back I would audition for stuff. If I didn’t book it, I would get at least call back, or they knew who I was. In LA, they were llike we know who you are, we just don’t want you. I moved back home and a lot of things that I’m like, why won’t this happen for me? Happened. Domino effect. One after the other.
Yeah, I just saw you in Flatbush Misdemeanors.
I’m in three or four episodes of that. I did That Damn Michael Che. It was unreal and a blessing. I’m really grateful.
All while living in your childhood bedroom.
Childhood bedroom. The same stuffed animals that I used to masturbate to when I was nine. They’re still there. It’s not as hot when you’re 50. When you’re 13 it’s sexy. When you’re 50 it’s sad.
And you’re going through menopause.
And hot flashes! And my mother yelling at me to keep the Zoom noise down. Because I’m on Zoom. Powering! I have done so many Zoom comedy shows. All around the country and her bedroom wall, she shared with mine so I’d be on Zoom at 10am talking about hey, that Joe Biden, isn’t he old? And my mom can be heard through the wall yelling, ‘Jaqueline! Turn down the TV! Turn down the noise!’ I am like, I am 50. But this is what my life is now and hopefully you never know. This could be a TV show, because it’s really sad and funny at the same time.
Well, I haven’t shed any tears. I’ve only been laughing. Jackie Fabulous, thank you so much for for taking some time out of Las Vegas to chat with me. I really appreciate it.
Thank you for having me! I’ve been reading you guys, The Comic’s Comic, for years. I didn’t know there were real people behind it.
Just me. One person. It’s me.
Really! You’re the empire? Good for you! I love seeing what looks like big to all of us, and then it’s like one guy and my phone.
But I’m not in my parents’ house. So I’ve got that going for me.
You are winning at life. And I am winning everywhere except my home.
From The Comic's Comic 
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